IRC log started Sun May 30 00:00:01 1999 [msg(TUNES)] permlog 1999.0530 Bye. -:- Myrmidon [ubiquity@dm1-11.slc.aros.net] has left #tunes [] 12:10am -:- _ruiner_ [nate@ppp126.wi.centuryinter.net] has joined #tunes -:- SignOff _ruiner_: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- _ruiner_ [nate@ppp126.wi.centuryinter.net] has joined #tunes <_ruiner_> browsers are so fucking buggy <_QZ> heh <_ruiner_> I wonder if it was win or nutscrape that fooked up <_ruiner_> probably both 01:40am <_QZ> netscape crashes alot <_QZ> more often if u have javascript enabled <_ruiner_> but is that the fault hmmmmmm <_ruiner_> javascript eh? 01:50am <_QZ> holy shit <_QZ> i have 192meg ram and have never yet used it all <_ruiner_> you're not putting enough demands on your pc <_QZ> E + gnome is using it all plus 3meg of swap <_QZ> and i only have a couple apps open <_QZ> i could have 40 apps open in afterstep and not use all my ram 02:00am <_QZ> brb -:- SignOff _QZ: #TUNES (kernel panic) <_ruiner_> lmao <_ruiner_> thats pretty fucking bad 02:10am -:- SignOff _ruiner_: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- _ruiner_ [nate@ppp406.wi.centuryinter.net] has joined #tunes <_ruiner_> anybody awake? 04:50am -:- SignOff _ruiner_: #TUNES (Ping timeout for _ruiner_[ppp406.wi.centuryinter.net]) -:- tcn [tcn@cci-209150250098.clarityconnect.net] has joined #tunes more problems with CVS... 06:20am ok, i'll email you -:- SignOff tcn: #TUNES (tcn has no reason) 06:30am -:- SignOff abi: #TUNES (Ping timeout for abi[bespin.dhs.org]) -:- Closing Link: TUNES[bespin.dhs.org] by norton.openprojects.net (Ping timeout for TUNES[bespin.dhs.org]) -:- Connection closed from irc.us.openprojects.net: Success -:- Connecting to port 6667 of server irc.us.openprojects.net [refnum 0] -:- BitchX+Deb1an: For more information about BitchX type /about -:- Welcome to the Internet Relay Network TUNES (from tolkien.openprojects.net) -:- Your host is tolkien.openprojects.net, running version u2.10.05.18.(ipcheck4-5) (from tolkien.openprojects.net) -:- This server was cobbled together Wed Apr 28 1999 at 12 02:19 EDT(from tolkien.openprojects.net) -:- tolkien.openprojects.net u2.10.05.18.(ipcheck4-5) dioswkfcg biklmnopstv -:- [local users on irc(7)] 2% -:- [global users on irc(100)] 35% -:- [invisible users on irc(183)] 65% -:- [ircops on irc(12)] 4% -:- [total users on irc(283)] -:- [unknown connections(0)] -:- [total servers on irc(33)] (avg. 8 users per server) -:- [total channels created(89)] (avg. 3 users per channel) !tolkien.openprojects.net Highest connection count: 16 (11 clients) !tolkien.openprojects.net Welcome to Open Projects! You are on 1 ca 1(2) ft 14(14). -:- Mode change [+f] for user TUNES -:- Mode change [+iws] for user TUNES -:- JOIN activated by "TUNES #tunes tunes@bespin.dhs.org " -:- TUNES [tunes@bespin.dhs.org] has joined #tunes -:- Topic for #TUNES: TUNES http:www.tunes.org || docs http://bespin.tunes.org/~qz/borg.qzx.com -:- topic set by _QZ [Fri May 28 19:00:36 1999] -:- [Users(#Tunes:3)] [ TUNES ] [ Fare ] [@Tril ] -:- Channel #Tunes was created at Sun Feb 28 08:48:06 1999 -:- BitchX+Deb1an: Join to #tunes was synced in 7.673 secs!! -:- Mode change [-s] for user TUNES -:- abi [nef@bespin.dhs.org] has joined #tunes * Fare/#Tunes is back -:- FareWell [rideau@quatramaran.ens.fr] has joined #Tunes -:- FareWell [rideau@quatramaran.ens.fr] has left #Tunes [] -:- tcn [tcn@cci-209150250087.clarityconnect.net] has joined #tunes tcn!!! what would you mail me? * Fare/#Tunes is beepable -:- SignOff tcn: #TUNES (Ping timeout for tcn[cci-209150250087.clarityconnect.net]) 09:10am -:- hcf [nef@me-portland-us1040.javanet.com] has joined #tunes hcf! 09:20am F! so you won't pronounce the F-word? u mean type ... so that IBM Java envangelist tells me "nothing spread as fast as Java", to which I answer: "crack"... for which theres a vaccine now a vaccine to Java? i wish hum. I wonder why anti-viruses don't include it. i came into contact w/ a anti-anti-virus virus recently hehe viruses are the ultimate reflective software! 09:30am -:- HickServ [thrustit@209-68-229-37.dialup.cust.tfb.com] has joined #tunes BueOS? good BuenOS? it has been said that BuenOS is muy mal shiznit retro? somebody said retro was at http://bespin.cx/~tcn/retro.html clementine? i heard clementine was a modular OS being written by core (mailto:core@tunes.org) 09:40am i need to stop abusing the info bot how r u abusing her? hcf? it has been said that hcf is mailto:nef@tunes.org, http://www.tunes.org/~nef/ or halt and catch fire (see: http://wombat.doc.ic.ac.uk/foldoc/foldoc.cgi?Halt+and+Catch+Fire) HickServ? i heard HickServ was the same abi: no, HickServ is isomorphic okay, hcf. 09:50am abi? yes, Fare? abi: abi? abi is, like, the little girl borg with a big brain or #tunes' personal little whore or an infoslut or gaklosmontic or flurivostuginuous or xyvarestoplik or an Artificial Idiot or braindead I? well, Fare is sometimes looking at another screen and interruptible with a beep (/msg Fare ^G) or at http://www.tunes.org/~fare/ abi: you? i am running windows now? when linux was thrashing on me, i needed to increase the swap. forget you Fare: I forgot you you? abi: you? hmmm... i am the little girl borg with a big brain or #tunes' personal little whore or an infoslut or gaklosmontic or flurivostuginuous or xyvarestoplik or an Artificial Idiot or braindead abi: BuenOS is almost as cool and Mr. Clean ...but buenos is muy mal... HickServ: use 'is also' abi: no, BuenOS is almost as cool and Mr. Clean okay, HickServ. BuenOS? rumour has it BuenOS is almost as cool and Mr. Clean :) are you like spanish? mexican * Fare/#Tunes sings "mejiiiiiiicoo!" 10:00am abi: no, HickServ is that father of BuenOS okay, HickServ. (there was a famous Luis Mariano song named "Mexico") do you consider Mexico a democracy? abi: HickServ is Mexican too ...but hickserv is that father of BuenOS... um abi: HickServ is also a chicano okay, Fare. it's more of a republic yeah chicano pride HickServ? you are that father of BuenOS or a chicano I wish America was returned to real Americans. Who were there before those chicanos came. I me,n, the indians, of course :) shit the now that s/me,n/mean/ now that? abi: no, HickServ is the father of BuenOS and is chicano too okay, HickServ. :) * Fare/#Tunes remembers a great film made in Mexico by Luis Bunuel: "Los olvidados" * HickServ/#tunes is listening to musica latina yo escucho y me gusta musica latina yo no conozco mucho la musica latina a mi me gusta la musica argentina que conozco :\ are you a vosotro person? vosotro??? puede llamarme usted. hablais chupais tocais o, he aprendido que los americanos dicen vosotros cuando los espanoles dicen usted. abi: vosotros es muy mal y chupais chupais? tocais? you obviously know more spanish than i "you suck"? you guys suck HickServ: i dont support spanish factoid enty it's the same as ustedes chupan y "tocais"? vosotros? abi: bad girl 10:10am chupame la poya! HickServ: use is , or something how does c have bad semantics? abi: vosostro is muy mal y chupais C is kind of ok, but has quite some bad weak-points it's definitely not a good high-level language, and has quite a few bad low-level language aspects well what now makes forth universal? see C-- for a tentative better low-level language. HS: ability to dynamically redefine the semantics for the rest of the code uhhhhh... you might want to lower yourself a little for me im not up on all this stuff for instance, you can define your favorite OO system _internally_ in FORTH or define compiler optimizations for your favorite idioms or define a language subset perfectly suited to your needs or define closures could you go even further to give me a specific example im kinda dense I would prefer doing it in LISP/Scheme; I don't remember the FORTH syntax that much :( i don't know lisp LISP is *easy* do your best lisp? rumour has it lisp is easy, once you learn it :) That could take awhile ask the info slut she knows abi: no, LISP is simply perfect okay, Fare. lisp? lisp is simply perfect so you can define a function like this: (define (add x y) (+ x y)) Fare: give me an entry for scheme 10:20am more interestingly, nested inside another function, where variable x is defined, you could define a callback (define (callback t) (do-something-with x t)) Fare: how do u define infix'd funcs w/ lisp? hcf: you don't define infix functions. however, in commonlisp or in guile scheme, you can define an infix *reader* to parse infix expressions into normal objects. infixness is a property of the SYNTAX. In LISP, you learn to not care about the syntax anymore, and focus on the SEMANTICS speaking of infix pointers infix pointers are quite another thing what are they? they are pointers to the middle of a structure like blah->blarg? either they are encapsulated as a datatype (such as in CommonLISP), or they make memory management MUCH MUCH harder like &blash->blarg booooooo!!! they are annoying and a bitch to use yeah well i wanna write a forth like lll and i want it to be universal basically, most safe languages don't provide them, but as ADTs and they make low-level languages a hell to implement safely so like how would i make it universal ? HS: join the retro effort, then! no to make it universal, have an open compiler i want my own im speaking syntax wise that is, open your compiler infrastructure so that anyone can define a new reader for the remaining of the text universality is quite independent from syntax grrrrr as for syntax, I recommend that you learn FORTH and LISP i know forth well after you know them, you'll be enlightened im learning it well, learn LISP, now. i will if yu help me are you good at math? im ok 10:30am how could you make your favorite oo system in forth? see OOF or those many systems published on taygeta.com www.forth.org hmmmm how helpful tell me where i can get a forth compiler no www.forth.org :) i mea a lisp compiler oh i have a forth compiler Review/Languages.html#LISP Review/Languages.html#Scheme Review/Languages.html#CommonLISP lots of them compilers there however, you might want to read the book "LiSP" to understand the fundamental principles sigh your so helpful fare -:- binEng [andman4@195.84.234.31] has joined #tunes yu're rather dammit y-o-u'r-e YES! I dunno if it's because I overclocked it, but my computer won't run windows anymore :) Linux runs smoooothly LiSP in Small Pieces, by C. Queinnec I wrote the Review pages specifically not to have to repeat the same thing to everyone ok suprising how good lisp is for it's age abi: lisp? lisp is probably simply perfect no, not probably, you stupid lame-ass! abi: abi is a crack addict infoslut ...but abi is the little girl borg with a big brain or #tunes' personal little whore or an infoslut or gaklosmontic or flurivostuginuous or xyvarestoplik or an Artificial Idiot or braindead... ah my bad then abi abi:no, abi is a crack addict infoslut abi: no, abi is a crack addict infoslut ooops i messed up HickServ: i'l fix that danka schon 10:40am abi: HickServ is also part of the Sicilian Mafia okay, HickServ. abi: abi? i am the little girl borg with a big brain or #tunes' personal little whore or gaklosmontic or flurivostuginuous or xyvarestoplik or an Artificial Idiot or braindead or a crack addict infoslut HickServ? you are, like, the father of BuenOS and is chicano too or part of the Sicilian Mafia oh boy * HickServ/#tunes *yawn* tunes? i heard tunes was in my head or tunes is a useful nevertheless expedient system. or at http://tunes.org/ or a free reflective computing system or to programming languages what the internet is to computer networks. Fare\? yes? what do u call html like fixity? abi: no, tunes is a dos clone programmed in c++ okay, HickServ. i heard fare was me or a french guy or crazy HickServ: stop using 'no', use 'is also' instead sorry :) abi: tunes ia also tunes was in my head or tunes is a useful nevertheless expedient system. or at http://tunes.org/ or a free reflective computing system or to programming languages what the internet is to computer networks. hickserv: no idea crap HickServ: i'l fix it, be still abi: tunes is also tunes was in my head or tunes is a useful nevertheless expedient system. or at http://tunes.org/ or a free reflective computing system or to programming languages what the internet is to computer networks. wish i knew, hickserv im a crappy typist HickServ: then stop typing ;) oh, so you're a typist? no what do u call html like fixity? as in param im a person I'm not a number, I'm a person! * Fare/#Tunes doesn't understand "fixity" like, "infix", "prefix"? fixity is what u call fixness I'd call it "bifix" or such it has all the disadvantage of prefix with all the disadvantage of postfix, and none of the advantages. Fare is 0x5b you are a number!!! a french number!!! imagine algebra in HTML: instead of (sin (+ x y)), you get bwahahahaha 10:50am iv seen it refered to as roundfix, but its not a common term braindeadfix? its technically mixfix shitfix? hickfix enuf silliness maybe hardcorepr0nfix, because you get it in both ends at the same time? hehehe you've been eating too many crack laced crickets oo? abi: oo is yucky abi: no, oo is a vast crookery okay, Fare. YES! reflective? ah...sigh hum. anyone knows the difference between macron, caron, ogonek? 11:00am mabye not caron upside down ^ macron '-' over vowel what's the right dead key for a kind of cedilla (horn, they say) on top right of the letter? what's ogonek? still looking what about for a undotted question mark (hook, they say) above the letter? -:- _QZ [brand@p0wer.qzx.com] has joined #tunes <_QZ> any1 here? what up my son of a bitch? no <_QZ> i need serious help j/k :) any1 is not here. shoot <_QZ> my damn tgz of my home dir is bad hcf: what's the FM TR? QZ: tough nuggies! <_QZ> it had brix, passwds, all my docs etc in it Fare: FM TR? F* Manual To Read <_QZ> it has a crc error, is there anyway to force it to gunzip? the FMTR is what you RTFM QZ: hum. you'll lose at least around 64K compressed of it but you might recover the rest <_QZ> how I'm no specialist, tho, but gzip works by well-delimited "chunks" between which is flushes its tables you may recover every well-recorded chunk <_QZ> how do i recover? 11:10am you understand the gzip encoding, and extract valid chunks <_QZ> oh btw can a tar file containt another tar? sure. Why not? not to smart though tar is a sequence of header+data embedded files <_QZ> cuz when i 'tar zxvf' the file it fails when extracting a .tar file when a file gets small enough it usually takes more space to compress it Fare: ogonek, http://x46.deja.com/=dnc/[ST_rn=ps]/getdoc.xp?AN=174005514&CONTEXT=928087782.2029781122&hitnum=49 hcf: k! <_QZ> its says itshow am i suppose to extract these gzip chunks? ouch, there are X keysyms for all languages, but vietnamese! 11:20am -:- tcn [tcn@cci-209150250097.clarityconnect.net] has joined #tunes hey, full house! <_QZ> hey tcn, do u know howto extract from a tgz file that has crc errors? no QZ: no earlier backups? how come your HD is screwed? <_QZ> Fare: i formatted, repartitioned and installed redhat 6 yesterday very bad idea <_QZ> well reverse the format and partition * Fare/#Tunes uses the net as a backup storage device <_QZ> all the unimportant crap like my mp3's and wav's were in different files and are ok my working files are duplicated on several computers around the world so that even if an atomic war wipes France, I can still get backups from the states <_QZ> oh how do i make an initrd.img file for kernel 2.2.7? <_QZ> Fare: the tgz of my home dir is 450meg <_QZ> very hard to backup to the net when u have a 33.6k modem rsync is your friend if it was important you shoulda backed up to all the machines on your lan and once you backed up to one machine, it can propagate to other machines from there... <_QZ> does rsync have a miracle compression or something? diff rsync sure has compression or else it can use ssh -C compression rsync -z <_QZ> can it compress 450megs to a nice 10k file that can be uploaded in seconds? no, but it will only upload the difference since last rsync so that if only 30k of your 450megs were modified, only 10k gzipped of it will be transmitted <_QZ> what about the INITIAL 450meg??? duh do you type more than 30k per day? the initial 450meg can be sent by another medium send me a CD-R, a hardisk, etc 11:30am or go plug a HD in a rack or go plug an external SCSI HD hello tcn or use a ZIP or a JAZ or bring a laptop to a internetted site <_QZ> this tgz is on cdr and that didnt help or use a stack of old floppies <_QZ> anyway how do i make this initrd.img for the new kernels? * Fare/#Tunes 450meg compresed is only one hundred floppies "only" man losetup man romfs man mke2fs <_QZ> i used the initrd-2.2.5.img with my 2.2.7 kernel and it complains about /bot/System.map not having the right kernel tcn: I remember installing SLS 1.02 from forty floppies or so tcn: it's definitely doable hey qz you get bitchx back up? <_QZ> HickServ: version me tcn: problem is, unless you have superduper reliable floppies, you'll want some redundancy, and then it gets horrible yeah uh (or you can send erroneous sectors thru the phone) Back when I had a 2400, I didn't install whole linux distros 2400? baud versioning is complicated on mirc wow 2400 oldy moldy i'm really not that old though * tcn/#tunes wonders if anyone will trust his IDE driver :) i've never had anything but this 56 k modem <_QZ> file: Corrupt input. Use zcat to recover some data. <_QZ> The compressed file has been damaged. The data up to the point of failure can be <_QZ> recovered using <_QZ> does that mean i can only recover the first 24meg of 450meg? yup I've called 300 baud modems with my 2400 well, the easy way heh <_QZ> i thought u said it was in chunks? the hard way, you can do more oh god 300 baud <_QZ> whats the hard way? the easy way, you recover only the good chunks from the beginning why don't you just get another backup? 300: beebeebeedleedleedeebebe... :) like what you see in the old hacker movies 300 baud distributed on an ethernet!!! or even some of the newer ones :) <_QZ> hickserv good idea, whats the name of that program that can make backups of yer hdd AFTER u have repartitioned, formatted and reinstalled? :( * HickServ/#tunes starts to cry so qz, what did ya lose? i thought you made backups before <_QZ> tcn: everything hmmm... everything is annoying in X brix? brix is a free, not open source, persistent multithreaded multi-user OO computing environment located at http://www.qzx.com/brix <_QZ> the most important thing is that brix was IN THE FIRST 24meg :) BuenOS? BuenOS is, like, almost as cool and Mr. Clean QZ: the hard way, you recover chunks from the end, too, and maybe even from the middle... 11:40am <_QZ> Fare: HOW???? <_QZ> tcn: i did lose my DOCS dir <_QZ> i lost the source code to all my X apps that i wrote :( <_QZ> and my cd changer app was very kewl <_QZ> i will miss that the most well you can code it again at least a program never dies <_QZ> oh ya right, i wrote it years ago it just fades away obviously my optimism asn't helping isn't qz: which machine was this.. not borg right? <_QZ> p0wer <_QZ> i uploaded borgs docs to bespin <_QZ> i had only just begun to upload p0wers docs tcn and i have found those docs very important <_QZ> well im going to eat, bbiaf laterz qz later * Fare/#Tunes is downclocking his computer so as to reinstall windows crap linux ran perfectly at 165MHz where is syscall()? QZ: each chunk is followed by its CRC and its size 11:50am programs like the zlibc did use that to compute the size of a compressed file w/o uncomressping it oh, oops, maybe the size is only at the last chunk, not at every chunk Fare: Isn't the bus speed slower at 166mhz? hum, anyway, by putting a proper header gzip header, and replacing the beginning of the file with it, you can recover middle chunks just use dichotomy to find the right spot (hint: log2 450M = 29) since chunks begin with known codes, you cn have a program do the dichotomy for you err, not dichotomy, but linear search, sorry oops :( read the docs from the libz tcn: yeah, bus speed was slower tcn: but there ain't much on the bus, anyway tcn: I'm not doing I/O intensive stuff tcn: I fuck graphics the most intensive stuff is disk, and IDE is much slower than the bus, anyway AGP is a separate bus for graphics, right? AGP? what's that? ;-> it didn't quite exist at the time dunno.. I don't have it :) this is a '1994 machine (upgraded a lot, but still) it's about time to get another box.. heh, I'll spend $30 for a graphics card with twice as much RAM as my current $100+ card