IRC log started Tue Mar 23 00:00:00 1999 [msg(TUNES)] permlog 1999.0323 -:- SignOff _QZ: #TUNES (BRiX [http://www.qzx.com/brix] :: sleep) [openprojects]Foreign OperKill: NickServ killed talon (GHOST command used by talon_) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from zsoldos.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: varley.openprojects.net koontz.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net jordan.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from jordan.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net jordan.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net calvino.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from calvino.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net calvino.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from carter.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: forward.openprojects.net moore.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from moore.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net moore.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net crichton.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from crichton.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net crichton.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from zsoldos.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: mccaffrey.openprojects.net koontz.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from koontz.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net koontz.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from zsoldos.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net crichton.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net crichton.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from crichton.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net crichton.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: varley.openprojects.net fontana.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net varley.openprojects.net (Read error to varley.openprojects.net[207.16.36.11]: Connection reset by peer) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from zsoldos.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: tolkien.openprojects.net asprin.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from asprin.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net asprin.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net varley.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from varley.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net varley.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from hogan.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from hogan.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: hogan.openprojects.net herbert.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from hogan.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from hogan.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from hogan.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: gibson.openprojects.net saberhagen.openprojects.net (Server saberhagen.openprojects.net[62.232.6.53] closed the connection) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net lackey.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net lackey.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from lackey.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net lackey.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. !sterling.openprojects.net!! Remote CONNECT norton.openprojects.net 8005 from lilo [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net norton.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from norton.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net norton.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net saberhagen.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from saberhagen.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net saberhagen.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net saberhagen.openprojects.net (Server saberhagen.openprojects.net[62.232.6.53] closed the connection (<>)) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from carter.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net saberhagen.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from saberhagen.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net saberhagen.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from hogan.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net hogan.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. -:- Fare [rideau@quatramaran.ens.fr] has joined #Tunes [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: koontz.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: sterling.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from carter.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net carter.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. hey are you the main TUNES person? hum, yes I was wondering about the status of the project I'm supposed to write a paper on a non-standard OS, and I came across TUNES - didn't look like there'd be enough to write about though as far as implemented code goes, there ain't much indeed the status is: I'm working on the formal parts, others are working on a kernel, yet others I dunno, but we haven't reached "critical mass" for a chain reaction yet any tech specs available? 10:10am since its a course on OS theory, it may still be worth a close look not exactly tech specs, but lots of insightful tech data (well, IMNSHO) see also http://www.eleves.ens.fr:8080/home/madore/computers/tunes.html 10:20am gotta go. Please do not hesitate to send me comments/questions by e-mail * Fare/#Tunes is away 10:30am -:- hcf [nef@me-portland-us939.javanet.com] has joined #tunes -:- abi [nef@bespin.cx] has joined #tunes [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net break: sterling.openprojects.net saberhagen.openprojects.net (Ping timeout) [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Net junction: koontz.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net Completed net.burst from zsoldos.openprojects.net. [openprojects]!clarke.openprojects.net zsoldos.openprojects.net acknowledged end of net.burst. -:- SignOff hcf: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- -s That channel doesn't exist -:- Mode change [-s] for user TUNES -:- hcf [nef@me-portland-us222.javanet.com] has joined #tunes -:- _QZ [brand@p0wer.qzx.com] has joined #tunes -:- lar1 [larman@208.255.86.75] has joined #tunes Hey hoy -:- lar1 has changed the topic on channel #Tunes to: Any major tunes news? not afaik 05:00pm -:- SignOff lar1: #TUNES (Read error to lar1[208.255.86.75]: Connection reset by peer) -:- lar1 [larman@208.255.86.75] has joined #tunes hcf: What distro do you use? debian 05:10pm I am haveing a hell of a time going 2.0.34 -> 2.2.1 on RH 5.1... is it being stubborn because RH puts things in weird places? could be, why dont u use one of the other channels on this irc net? u'd probly get better answers Ok... 05:20pm <_QZ> damnit Huh? <_QZ> i have a million "short jump is out of range" errors Ummm <_QZ> doesnt nasm have a feature like tasm to make those reach? I dunno... I use TASM 05:30pm <_QZ> ah man this sucks, i changed the names of a bunch of system values and now i gotta change them in all my files Hehehe Change them back :) <_QZ> the new names make them more understandable who needs to understand when you can be cryptic? <_QZ> i sure hope the stupid bios will load my objects on this build <_QZ> the last build it would only load them on my laptop <_QZ> gave an error on all other machines That happened to me with RAvEN once <_QZ> it use to work and i havent changed the code <_QZ> it will load the bootsector and kernel just fine I really hate that... <_QZ> but when the kernel setup code tries to load the objects it fails <_QZ> and the kernel used the same exact code that the bootsector used to load the kernel It just stopped working? <_QZ> no <_QZ> the code loads the kernel on all machines <_QZ> bios loads bootsector which loads the kernel which loads the startup objects And the kernel is having some trouble lately? <_QZ> the bootsector will load the kernel on all my machines everytime <_QZ> but the kernel will only load the objects on mylaptop <_QZ> but it use to work on all machines weird... <_QZ> i turn off the floppy after it reads, so i thought maybe it was failing cuz the floppy wasnt spinning <_QZ> but my laptop is the slowest machine -:- Ken [cpe2@63.10.184.85] has joined #Tunes <_QZ> hola ken Keep the floppy spinging longer just to test it out mabye? Hey ken hello hoy, Ken <_QZ> well there is a problem there <_QZ> the bootsector includes the same function that the kernel includes -:- SignOff Ken: #TUNES (Leaving) <_QZ> and its that function that turns off the floppy 05:40pm Soo, where is teh problem? -:- Ken [cpe2@63.10.184.85] has joined #Tunes <_QZ> ken? lost the connection am i interrupting? <_QZ> nope <_QZ> just having an OS discussion * lar1/#tunes is much less knoledgeable then _QZ So, what were you discussing? A kernel , a BS, some OBJs and it not working <_QZ> just hoping that this next build will work correctly what is a BS? Boot sector <_QZ> bootsector and what is this kernel supposed to do? <_QZ> BRiX Be a kernel? Handle user input, allocate mem, etc <_QZ> the BS uses the same exact drive_read function that the kernel does i mean, what is this specific kernel supposed to that differentiates it from others <_QZ> and it worked fine on earlier builds <_QZ> the BS would use drive_read to load the kernel <_QZ> and the kernel would use drive_read to load a bunch of objects so where is it hanging? at the first reading? <_QZ> but on the last build drive_read worked fine loading the kernel on all my machines, but failed to load the objects on all but one machine <_QZ> it doesnt hang, the bios returns an error code 'hang' not meant literally What err code? <_QZ> dunno <_QZ> i only have it print 'error' Ummm, mabye figure out the err first? 05:50pm how exactly does the drive_read function work? int 13 mabye? <_QZ> ya Use the floppy controler dircetly? (I mean you should use the fdd controler directly) <_QZ> hahah, i changed all the names to the new names and the stupid "short jump is out of range" errors went away :) <_QZ> it would bloat the setup code to have direct floppy code <_QZ> the less code, the faster it boots Write your own ISR for 13h and have it just load that? <_QZ> any code i write must be loaded during boot <_QZ> that slows down the boot process <_QZ> int 13h works fine How fast do you need this? <_QZ> i am going for instant on Errr, good lord, that is like the difference between BASIC and asm... -:- SignOff hcf: #TUNES (Leaving) <_QZ> i want the machine to be in the brix ui in less than a second after the bios loads the BS I don't think that is going to happen... <_QZ> so if u got a fast split second bios like the asus p2bd then brix will be up and running within 2 seconds after powering up <_QZ> booting from floppy i can get like 10 seconds, the hdd is MUCH faster Do you have all yer drivers? <_QZ> what drivers? <_QZ> brix only loads stuff as its needed ethernet, sound, etc <_QZ> no i dont have those 2 yet 06:00pm <_QZ> but those 2 will be next in line And you think you can still be in 2 sec from power up? <_QZ> the only reason ethernet would need to be laoded at boot is if the machine is a server <_QZ> if it wasa server then it will need to load ethernet plus several servers <_QZ> that will take several seconds longer So it wont be instant! <_QZ> not for a server <_QZ> but the first part of the Ui that gets loaded is the login screen -:- SignOff Ken: #TUNES (Leaving) <_QZ> so u must type in yer password and the system will be loading stuff while u type Do things get loaded while the system waits for user login? Oh, ok Thread! Thread! Thread! The tool of the devil... <_QZ> u will receive a login screen within 1 second <_QZ> no matter what kinda box And be able to log in in how long? <_QZ> how fast can u type? fast <_QZ> :) 386/16? <_QZ> the system also attempts to predict who will login Why? To preload? <_QZ> and it will be loading yer workspace settings <_QZ> while u login <_QZ> the thing i hate about linux/X is that i must leave it running 24/7 cuz i open all these windows and the time it takes to bootup linux/X and reopen them is way to much time <_QZ> with brix u can close yer workspace, shutdown, reboot, and yer workspace will be in the same state as when u closed it <_QZ> all within seconds <_QZ> bbiaf eating Very cool ok 06:10pm is tunes planned to have a single address space? <_QZ> back 06:40pm cool How can I make the serial port look like the keyboard? <_QZ> in yer OS? <_QZ> u make a driver that has the same interface as the keyboard driver but it reads from the serial port Ok, cause I have a program that I dont have srouce to and I need it to think up is pressed when I send a certin code through the sir port <_QZ> oh <_QZ> a dos program? ya <_QZ> write a tsr that hooks int 16h I am hooking a NES controler to my NES emulator Make the old ISR go first, then my ISR? <_QZ> keep a link to the old int 16h code so the tsr can call the old int 16h for keystrokes <_QZ> no wait <_QZ> u wont need to hook int 16h Why not? <_QZ> u need to hook the irq for the serial port <_QZ> and just dump the characters into the keyboard buffer 06:50pm How might I do that? <_QZ> but if the program bypasses the bios then yer screwed <_QZ> i know that games dont use the bios keyboard handler <_QZ> i would assume a game emu would also not use it crap But it would still read the buffer, right? <_QZ> no How would it get the keystrokes then? <_QZ> direct keyboard reads Ack So if I want controller support, I have to write my own EMU... great <_QZ> no <_QZ> u can always get a keybard Y cable a what? <_QZ> so u have 2 keyboard ports, then get a keyboard controller chip and hook it to yer nes pad <_QZ> both the keyboard and nes pad would send data to the motherboards contoller Then I need datasheets on keyborad chips... I wanted to use the KISS method... err keyboard chip <_QZ> i attached a microphone to my tandy1000's joystick port Thats easy though... <_QZ> :) <_QZ> so is the keyboard thing But you didn't need much in the way of chips for that, right? <_QZ> ya i have to amplify the signal ;:) Op amp... simple one chip.... 8 pins <_QZ> no i used discrete components Why????? <_QZ> cuz its a really nice filtered amp <_QZ> op amps suck 07:00pm op amps are cool! <_QZ> 3 transistors, 9 resistors, 6 caps Why so much filtering on a MIC??? <_QZ> bandpass filtering Why? lots of niose by you machine? <_QZ> just to filter out background noise <_QZ> if im gonna build something its not gonna be cheap Hmmm, see I'd just use an LM386 and be done with it... oh whell <_QZ> i was write voice recognition programs and didnt want any noise present OOOOOOO, thats just a tad different So, how many pins are on the keyboard drivers? 40? 07:10pm How do I use these keyboard driver chips? <_QZ> u dont need a keyboard chip Didn't you say I did?? Just a PIC to emulate one :) What should I use then? 07:20pm -:- lar1 is now known as lar_eating -:- SignOff lar_eating: #TUNES (Read error to lar_eating[208.255.86.75]: Connection reset by peer) -:- hcf [nef@me-portland-us923.javanet.com] has joined #tunes -:- SignOff hcf: #TUNES (Leaving) -:- SignOff _QZ: #TUNES (Ping timeout for _QZ[p0wer.qzx.com]) [msg(TUNES)] newlog 1999.0324 IRC log ended Wed Mar 24 00:00:01 1999